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	<title>Comments on: This Is Why Insurance Companies Fear The Public Option</title>
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	<description>Just another Firedoglake weblog</description>
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		<title>By: fatster</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53187</link>
		<dc:creator>fatster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 14:02:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53187</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Poll: Just As Last Week, Public Still Overwhelmingly Supports Public Option&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;By Brian Beutler - July 1, 2009, 8:54AM&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“A new Quinnipiac poll finds that a large majority of Americans would like to see government increase its involvement in health care. Sixty-nine percent of those surveyed said they support a public option.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/07/poll-just-as-last-week-public-still-overwhelmingly-supports-public-option.php?ref=fpa&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.....hp?ref=fpa&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Just imagine if 70% of our Senators and Congresscritters supported the public option.  Why, we might get something beneficial in exchange for all our tax dollars they spend.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Poll: Just As Last Week, Public Still Overwhelmingly Supports Public Option</strong></p>
<p>By Brian Beutler &#8211; July 1, 2009, 8:54AM</p>
<p>“A new Quinnipiac poll finds that a large majority of Americans would like to see government increase its involvement in health care. Sixty-nine percent of those surveyed said they support a public option.”</p>
<p><a href="http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/07/poll-just-as-last-week-public-still-overwhelmingly-supports-public-option.php?ref=fpa" rel="nofollow">http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo&#8230;..hp?ref=fpa</a></p>
<p>Just imagine if 70% of our Senators and Congresscritters supported the public option.  Why, we might get something beneficial in exchange for all our tax dollars they spend.</p>
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		<title>By: i4u2bi</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53182</link>
		<dc:creator>i4u2bi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 13:26:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53182</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Everywhere one goes in this country greed is still just plain greed. How much greed ( profit) should be allowed in the health-care and healing dept?…probably none, agreed?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everywhere one goes in this country greed is still just plain greed. How much greed ( profit) should be allowed in the health-care and healing dept?…probably none, agreed?</p>
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		<title>By: wigwam</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53176</link>
		<dc:creator>wigwam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 11:02:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53176</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;OMG!  A public option would &lt;strong&gt;“unleash the miracle of free enterprise”!&lt;/strong&gt; &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And that would lower stock prices for the top for-profit insurers, who in their hearts are really socialist (corporate) welfare queens.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OMG!  A public option would <strong>“unleash the miracle of free enterprise”!</strong> </p>
<p>And that would lower stock prices for the top for-profit insurers, who in their hearts are really socialist (corporate) welfare queens.</p>
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		<title>By: robspierre</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53159</link>
		<dc:creator>robspierre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 04:46:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53159</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I find it funny the way that the politicos and insurance CEOs talk about containing costs. It’s always about not paying for care. But they never mention the cost of the mergers and related layoffs that led to the consolidation you describe. Mergers aren’t cheap. Lots of debt service.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Combine these costs with profits that are at least in the 30% range and with the enormous overhead costs generated by claims avoidance strategies and accounting gimmicks, and it is clear that, despite soaring consumer and employer costs, less and less is going into actual healthcare.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I too am a free-enterprise, capitalist sort. But the problem with enforcing honest competition and regulating the abusive practices of for-profit health insurance companies is that the companies would evaporate in the process. Taking fraud out of the health insurance industry is like taking the cattle out of the feedlot business. Health insurance cannot be profitable without cheating. In fact, the industry is probably not probably sustainable even with the cheating. There is, as you say, money to be made in healthcare–but not in health insurance. You just cannot make money insuring health given the ratio of losses to subscribers–everyone gets sick regularly and  expensively sick eventually. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The unsustainability of the business model is why I think you are almost certainly right when you say that the real concern that drives industry lobbying is the potential loss of short-term, monopoly-driven profit. Health insurance is going the way of AIG and knows it. The real money has been made in the mergers, the related leverage, the stock maneuvers, and the executive compensation.&lt;br /&gt;
The winners have already gotten out. It’s those that got into the game late or stayed in too long that are lobbying Congress–the highrollers that bought high and now want to wring out whatever profit they can before the inevitable happens.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find it funny the way that the politicos and insurance CEOs talk about containing costs. It’s always about not paying for care. But they never mention the cost of the mergers and related layoffs that led to the consolidation you describe. Mergers aren’t cheap. Lots of debt service.</p>
<p>Combine these costs with profits that are at least in the 30% range and with the enormous overhead costs generated by claims avoidance strategies and accounting gimmicks, and it is clear that, despite soaring consumer and employer costs, less and less is going into actual healthcare.</p>
<p>I too am a free-enterprise, capitalist sort. But the problem with enforcing honest competition and regulating the abusive practices of for-profit health insurance companies is that the companies would evaporate in the process. Taking fraud out of the health insurance industry is like taking the cattle out of the feedlot business. Health insurance cannot be profitable without cheating. In fact, the industry is probably not probably sustainable even with the cheating. There is, as you say, money to be made in healthcare–but not in health insurance. You just cannot make money insuring health given the ratio of losses to subscribers–everyone gets sick regularly and  expensively sick eventually. </p>
<p>The unsustainability of the business model is why I think you are almost certainly right when you say that the real concern that drives industry lobbying is the potential loss of short-term, monopoly-driven profit. Health insurance is going the way of AIG and knows it. The real money has been made in the mergers, the related leverage, the stock maneuvers, and the executive compensation.<br />
The winners have already gotten out. It’s those that got into the game late or stayed in too long that are lobbying Congress–the highrollers that bought high and now want to wring out whatever profit they can before the inevitable happens.</p>
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		<title>By: cwcw</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53148</link>
		<dc:creator>cwcw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 00:38:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53148</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I agree with selise @4 - In addition to her arguement,&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;With the advent of the electronic Medical Record, every time you sneeze it will be recorded in your record, and it will be used against you when you try to get insurance coverage.  We aren’t hearing much about the eMR in the insurance debate, but I believe it will be a prime tool used by insurance companies to deny us coverage.  The ONLY defense against this abuse is single payer.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And imagine what single payer could do for the abuses of worker’s compensation and auto accident medical claims?  Society would only benefit!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Of course the insurance industry as we know it would take a hit, but there will still be a niche for pet insurance and insurance for elective and cosmetic procedures.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with selise @4 &#8211; In addition to her arguement,</p>
<p>With the advent of the electronic Medical Record, every time you sneeze it will be recorded in your record, and it will be used against you when you try to get insurance coverage.  We aren’t hearing much about the eMR in the insurance debate, but I believe it will be a prime tool used by insurance companies to deny us coverage.  The ONLY defense against this abuse is single payer.  </p>
<p>And imagine what single payer could do for the abuses of worker’s compensation and auto accident medical claims?  Society would only benefit!</p>
<p>Of course the insurance industry as we know it would take a hit, but there will still be a niche for pet insurance and insurance for elective and cosmetic procedures.</p>
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		<title>By: Kathryn in MA</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53122</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathryn in MA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 20:37:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53122</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I don’t think the congresspeeps understand the gravity of the situation. More people are dying from neglect-by-insurance-companies than by all causes together in Iraq/Afghanistan. (no link, just my wag) People are dying, facing ruination, going bankrupt, losing their homes, and going short on their meds.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The insurance companies had 40 years (since Nixon) to get this gig right, to make a profit, AND take care of the citizenry. But noooooooooooooooooooooooooo. So they have shown themselves as incapable of being in the business. End of story. Now, it’s time for single payer. We get to have the plan the congresspeeps have.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don’t think the congresspeeps understand the gravity of the situation. More people are dying from neglect-by-insurance-companies than by all causes together in Iraq/Afghanistan. (no link, just my wag) People are dying, facing ruination, going bankrupt, losing their homes, and going short on their meds.</p>
<p>The insurance companies had 40 years (since Nixon) to get this gig right, to make a profit, AND take care of the citizenry. But noooooooooooooooooooooooooo. So they have shown themselves as incapable of being in the business. End of story. Now, it’s time for single payer. We get to have the plan the congresspeeps have.</p>
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		<title>By: selise</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53121</link>
		<dc:creator>selise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 20:31:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53121</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;healthcare insurance companies hold down costs by, among other things, denying coverage. that is how they compete. how is more competition, even a public option, going to change that?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;even people with insurance don’t get the care they need if they can’t afford the co-pays, co-insurance or deductibles. how is a public option going to change that?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;how exactly is a public option going to provide coverage to all those 48 million without insurance and the 10’s of millions more who are underinsured all the while controlling total health care costs?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;i see how single payer universal healthCARE can do that. i don’t see how a public health insurance option can.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>healthcare insurance companies hold down costs by, among other things, denying coverage. that is how they compete. how is more competition, even a public option, going to change that?</p>
<p>even people with insurance don’t get the care they need if they can’t afford the co-pays, co-insurance or deductibles. how is a public option going to change that?</p>
<p>how exactly is a public option going to provide coverage to all those 48 million without insurance and the 10’s of millions more who are underinsured all the while controlling total health care costs?</p>
<p>i see how single payer universal healthCARE can do that. i don’t see how a public health insurance option can.</p>
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		<title>By: atdleft</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53118</link>
		<dc:creator>atdleft</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 20:12:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53118</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thank you, Mr. Dog. If these “centrists” truly believe in “the free market”, then they’ll allow the public option to actually compete with the HMOs. Why are they so afraid of competition?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Mr. Dog. If these “centrists” truly believe in “the free market”, then they’ll allow the public option to actually compete with the HMOs. Why are they so afraid of competition?</p>
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		<title>By: hychka</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53109</link>
		<dc:creator>hychka</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 18:11:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53109</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;You go, Dog! Absolutely correct analysis. These boys are afraid for their jobs. A private insurance company is really only a lame excuse for providing health care coverage when compared to a single pay national public health care plan, which has no need for profit, which caps its overhead within reasonable boundries and isn’t taxed. Also, if all are included in a plan, there is no need for insurance..the total bill is the total bill…no adverse groups to avoid, no accuarial reserves to hoard, no army of nitpickers employed to void valid claims.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I always thought that government’s job is to do for the people what they can’t do themselves…Americans can not insure health care themselves and neither can the private sector.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You go, Dog! Absolutely correct analysis. These boys are afraid for their jobs. A private insurance company is really only a lame excuse for providing health care coverage when compared to a single pay national public health care plan, which has no need for profit, which caps its overhead within reasonable boundries and isn’t taxed. Also, if all are included in a plan, there is no need for insurance..the total bill is the total bill…no adverse groups to avoid, no accuarial reserves to hoard, no army of nitpickers employed to void valid claims.</p>
<p>I always thought that government’s job is to do for the people what they can’t do themselves…Americans can not insure health care themselves and neither can the private sector.</p>
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		<title>By: gstockman</title>
		<link>http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6036/comment-page-1#comment-53101</link>
		<dc:creator>gstockman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:51:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/6036#comment-53101</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Hey Dog,&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Blue Cross monopoly in Alabama has had to layoff four percent of its 3,800 employees because “more people are losing their jobs and their health insurance.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I wonder how many of those not so lucky 151 people being laid off will be able to afford their health insurance now.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Good article!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;George Stockman&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Dog,</p>
<p>The Blue Cross monopoly in Alabama has had to layoff four percent of its 3,800 employees because “more people are losing their jobs and their health insurance.”</p>
<p>I wonder how many of those not so lucky 151 people being laid off will be able to afford their health insurance now.</p>
<p>Good article!</p>
<p>George Stockman</p>
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