In the final presidential debate, Senator John McCain repeated long debunked lies about Sen. Barack Obama’s record on the Illinois Born Alive Protection Act, lies that heve been repreated and promoted since Alan Keyes lost to Obama in the US Seante race in 2004. This full frontal effort may appeal to the extreme far-right of his base, but it was a dial test loser on CNN. Americans are fed up with the far-right’s Culture War. The CBS insta-poll shows Obama winning the debate 53 percent to 22 percent with 24 percent saying is was a draw.
The extreme fringe of anti-choice community has been pushing this attack for months, in television and radio ads from 527s and special interest lobbyists like the National Right to Life Committee.
The coordinated efforts are suggest that in voting against the Illinois Born Alive Infant Protection Act Senator Barack Obama is "responsible for killing a bill to provide care and protection for babies who are born alive after abortions" and that "he later misrepresented the bill’s content." NRLC has filed a request for an advisory opinion from the FEC as to whether the ad falls within FEC guidelines, TPM reported.
The anti-choice movement says it needs to correct the record. The Obama campaign maintains that the Senator opposed the state bill but would have supported the federal version because the federal bill, unlike the state bill, couldn’t have affected or undermined existing abortion law. In an interview with the Christian Broadcasting Network’s David Brody, Obama said of National Right to Life Committee (NRLC), "here’s a situation where folks are lying." Then in August, NRLC produced documentation showing that the 2003 version of the Born Alive bill included an amendment protecting Roe, rendering the state bill virtually identical to the federal bill, which Obama says he would have supported.
But, points out the non-partisan, independent FactCheck.org, since state, not federal law, governs the actual practice of abortion care, even with the stipulation that the bill does not provide protections to "any member of the species homo sapiens at any point prior to being born alive as defined in this Section," the bill could still have been used to interfere with abortion provisions. A 2003 Planned Parenthood fact sheet explained:
SB 1082 & SB 1083 are NOT the same as the so-called "Born Alive Infant Protection Act" which was recently passed in the U. S. House. The federal legislation is considered to be a restatement of existing federal law. It does not amend or change current Illinois law. Federal law does not regulate abortion practice. That is left to the states. Therefore, it is state legislation that would affect abortion practice in Illinois. The package of SB 1082 & SB 1083 creates new provisions in Illinois law. Although the definition is similar to the proposed federal legislation, its application would have a different impact on state abortion law.
Also unlike the federal bill, the package of bills under consideration by the Illinois State Senate included a measure that would have permitted legal action "on the child’s behalf." In other words, doctors and health care facilities could be held liable for damages, "including costs of care to preserve and protect the life, health and safety of the child, punitive damages, and costs and attorney’s fees," if the hospital, health care facility or health care provider "harms or neglects the child or fails to provide medical care to the child after the child’s birth."
Planned Parenthood’s Pam Sutherland told the New York Times, "I can tell you the sponsors always wanted the entire package of bills, which were introduced together and analyzed together…They never wanted them separated, because they wanted to make sure that physicians would be chilled into not performing abortions for fear of going to jail" (emphasis mine).
When a 2005 version of the bill with the explicit protection for state abortion law Obama had held out for was considered, it passed the state Senate unanimously. Obama had left the State Senate for Washington by the time the bill came to a vote. But Obama campaign spokesman Tommy Vietor has said that Obama would have voted for that bill if he had been a state legislator when it was considered, much as he says he would have supported the federal bill, which wouldn’t have impacted non-existent federal law.
Existing Law Protected Infants
Pam Sutherland of Planned Parenthood of Illinois explains that there is no way to verify how many, if any, abortions result in viable live births, as Illinois does not track these statistics. Still, regardless of the number of such births, these infants deserve to be protected.
But existing law in Illinois clearly required doctors to provide medical care in the unlikely event that a viable fetus was born as a result of an abortion procedure. "Nothing in BAIPA addressed this situation in some way that wasn’t already covered," explains
Mary Dixon, legislative director at the ACLU of Illinois. In any such instance, Illinois law stipulates that the child receive medical care by pediatric specialist to maximize chances of survival.
Obama acknowledged this when registering his opposition to BAIPA.
To the state Senate on April 4, 2002, Obama explained, "This issue
ultimately is about abortion and not live births. Because if there are children being born alive, I, at least, have confidence that a doctor who is in that room is going to make sure that they’re looked after."
In addition, BAIPA was riddled with provisions that alarmed both defenders of abortion rights and the mainstream medical community in Illinois, including the Illinois Hospital Association and the Illinois State Medical Society, both of which opposed the package of bills. Defenders of abortion rights said that the state law could come into
conflict with existing law regulating abortion, and could potentially be used to undermine or challenge Roe v. Wade. Hospitals and physicians’ associations, meanwhile, decried the bill’s interference with
the physician-patient relationship and the harsh civil and criminal penalties that could be imposed on physicians and hospitals who perform abortions that result in a "live-born" fetus.
Equally troubling is the fact that the law Obama opposed would have required doctors to make efforts at life-saving for any infant that shows a "sign of life" even when there was no chance the baby would survive, a practice that Dr. Lauren Streicher, an obstetrician at Northwestern Medical Hospital who often delivers pre-term babies who will not survive, refers to as "torture." "When you deliver a baby" – either through labor or termination – "that is clearly not going to be viable, we knew 100 percent it would not survive, there are two courses you could take," explains Streicher. "You could wrap the baby up in a blanket, give him or her comfort care, let the parents hold the baby, say goodbye, and go through the grieving process. Or, if we were required to make survival efforts, the baby is whisked away by the high-risk pediatrician and tubes start going in. It’s torture for the baby, terrible for the parents, who have most often lost a desperately desired pregnancy."
Says Dr. Streicher, "A fetus that can clearly be ‘not viable’ could potentially be born with a stable heart-beat. Is that a sign of life? Yes. Is that fetus then viable? No."
Campaigns Volley BAIPA Ads
Obama’s votes on the Born Alive Infant Protection Act have been subject to attack ads dating as far back as his race for the U.S. Senate against Alan Keyes in 2004. Current television ads targeting voters in Ohio and New Mexico feature thirty-one-year-old Gianna Jessen imploring Barack Obama, "Sen. Obama, please support born alive infant protections." Jessen’s story? She was born through a "failed abortion," and she and BornAliveTruth.org, the 527 "independent" political committee responsible for the ads, maintain that by voting against BAIPA, Obama neglected to support the highest possible standard of care for infants in Illinois.
Beliefnet.com editor-in-chief Steven Waldman observes, "the one thing [the ad] does not prove is its central political claim…the key legal goal [of the Born Alive Infant Protection Act] was not protecting viable infants – who already were protected under law – but non-viable infants and those on the borderline. Gianna Jessen, by her own account, was a clear ‘viable’ infant. She was aborted at seven and half months, and therefore would have almost certainly been covered by any existing statute."
BornAliveTruth was founded by Jill Stanek, the anti-choice blogger and a nurse who testified in front of Congress that she witnessed infants not provided appropriate medical care after abortion (Stanek’s testimony does not specify whether the infants were viable). The ads are bank-rolled by abstinence-only profiteer Raymond Ruddy, who has supported far-right anti-choice and anti-gay initiatives across the country, and whose company, Maximus, has received over $100 million in federal contracts from the Bush administration to promote abstinence-only-until-marriage programs.
Obama, for his part, has responded directly to BornAliveTruth’s ads. The ad, which began airing September 21, tells viewers, "Now votes taken out of context, accusing Obama of letting infants die? It’s a despicable lie." FactCheck.org has weighed in with a clear-eyed assessment of the volley, writing that:
In the ad, Jessen says that "if Senator Obama had his way, I wouldn’t be here." She’s wrong. Anyone born in Illinois under the same circumstances as Jessen (who was actually born in California) would have been protected under the state’s law as it stood, with or without the legislation that Obama opposed.
But FactCheck.org also points out that Obama’s response included misstatements. Obama’s ad implies that the McCain campaign itself had sponsored the ad, when BornAliveTruth.org did; it also accuses McCain of opposing abortion including in cases of rape and incest, which running mate Sarah Palin does but McCain doesn’t.
Will Palin Bring Up BAIPA?
GOP Vice-Presidential nominee Sarah Palin suggested that Obama hasn’t heard the end of BAIPA from her, either. In an interview with Katie Couric, Palin suggested that passage of BAIPA was necessary to ensure the provision of life-saving medical care to viable babies and, moreover, that Obama would allow medical help not to be administered in such situations. "And those who, like Barack Obama, would support measures that would actually allow in a botched abortion, late-term abortion, that child being born alive, to allow it to not receive medical help to save that child’s life," said Palin, "That’s extremism to me." If Palin throws another punch at Obama on BAIPA to stoke her religious right base, and if the FEC okays the National Right to Life Committee’s radio ads, we’ll undoubtedly see a new round of distortion over what BAIPA would actually do, and what Obama supports and believes.





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mcFraud: Debunked R Us.
Jane had a good post up the day she appeared on c-span with some nutjob who talked about that “born alive” nonsense. The stories are all bullshit.
here it is
http://campaignsilo.firedoglak…..g-fantasy/
It would have been a much quicker pol death if Bush could have run for a third term. We never take the easy way out.
1,796 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen RHRealityCheck:
Thanx for the heads up Citizen RHRC, this attempt by the fascists to use the courts to spew the lies that poison democratic discussion of issues is another example of the use of our institutions of justice to impose the tryanny of the minority…the idea of the “rule of law” is dead at the moment, all we have are corrupt institutions that are used to limit the individual rights of citizens and impose rule by the wealthy and well born.
The push back should be on McCain’s condescending remarks about the health of a woman. The Obama campaign should come out with an ad that shows that entire clip and then end with “Do you want this man to make a judgment about the health of your daughter or friend?” This election should be the final nail in the coffin that the majority of voters want to criminalize women. I thought the abortion segment in the debate last night was an excellent defense of womens rights by Obama. Explicitly stating that no one is pro-abortion and reaching out to help reduce unwanted pregnancies was exactly the right tone to me. McCain came across as a total robot and uncaring to women. He should get absolutely hammered on his remarks but as usual the timid MSM won’t discuss that segment. They would rather swoon over Joe.
Last night while watching the debate, I couldn’t help feeling satisfied about the fact that I have already voted.
This seems to me to have been basically a backdoor attempt to block a single procedure: intact dilation and extraction also known as partial birth abortion. Before it was unlawed in the dubious Supreme Court decision Gonzales v. Carhart, it was a rare late term, i.e. third trimester operation initiated for reasons of the mother’s health. The idea behind it was that removal of the fetus intact by partial birthing (exiting the fetus from the uterus) avoided health risks (infection, hemorrhage, etc.) associated with alternate procedures, the principal one being dismemberment and removal of the fetus in the uterus. Because the fetus only exits the uterus in pieces, there is no birthing. What is so odd about all this is that it is a far more grisly procedure but it is still perfectly legal to perform it whereas the safer less grisly intact dilation and extraction is not.
but..but..but, if Senator Obama prevails, won’t ACORN destroy the fabric of American politics, life on earth, plus the time-space continuum, rending a hole in reality itself?
ding
“But on the other side, it didn’t say nothin…
http://freewayblogger.blogspot…..signs.html
That side was made for you and me.”
IIRC, there were something like 4 “partial birth” abortions in the year before the SCOTUS case?
McBush could have responded to his questions with random verses from nursery rhymes and 22% would have thought he had won (no doubt the same fantasy-land ignoramuses who think Bush/Cheney are doing a good job). And the pundits would have described his performance insightful.
ot – dodd’s banking hearing with levitt has begun.
I just found out…
{{{{Barbara}}}}
Nursery rhymes would probably have served Mc better than what he did last night.
Hey, selise, 73 hearings! Wow. They did a lot of good. /s
It is important to understand the rethug mind. Ignorance rules! Only those deemed worthy to dispense new dogma shall have the right to provide information.
maybe not just a single procedure? could it have been an attempt to continue to push the idea that it is appropriate for the supreme court to make health care decisions that should be left to the woman and her doctor?
damn. i need that list. calling dodd’s office now!
I have seen, on several sites, the comment that Mc ended up speaking only to the base. He jumped into the middle of all their talking points, and never explained what it was about for those who are not intimately involved in the arguement. Abortion was one such subject, but he did the same thing with ACORN. Thus, O’s clear headed explanation was the one the viewers were left with.
I didn’t perceived that phenomenon in real time, because I am aware of the wingnuts’ talking points. But on reflection, it is true, and probably made Mc look even more incomprehensible to the low info viewer.
o/t
bwaahaaahaaaa ! you forgot “delusional”
was just coming over here to post this: RedState had a front pager declare Obama the next president . . . and then removed the post from the site – but you can read some of the demoralized’s comments here
still waiting for screen shot of original post
A commenter over at C&L said that Joe Wurtzelbacher, aka Joe Plumber is related to ‘Charles Keating’, yes that one. No linky for verification so it’s just talky talk I guess.
It wouldn’t surprise me. This procedure was singled out as a convenient wedge issue and tool to begin ondoing Roe. It played on people’s emotions about “birth” and their inherent squeamishness. That there are a lot of other surgical procedures probably most that would cause them to hurl doesn’t come up because people just don’t want to know.
Surgeon’s motto, according to one I knew, is: To cut is to cure. Kinda made me want to hurl.
I can’t believe it, O’Reilly on talk radio gone wacko. Does he have a split personality disorder? The right is fractured and it’ll take years for the GOP to get their party back on tract. In the future we talk about the fall of the religious right during the bush administration. I posted this for the late nighters and am reposting it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…..re=related
found it ! – pure progressive porn
RedState lamentations
The Guardian in UK has the public voting for who won
the debate….92% for Obama, 6% for McHamster. Gotta
love those Brits!
ah. just listened again – only recent banking hearings. not so useful to me.
Oh Oh if McShame gets in office he will give them the same treatment as Spain and try to kick them out of the G-8
Mc favors G1. Already said he’d kick Russia out, then Spain, soon all the rest.
this discussion, and last night’s “debate” reminded me that while mccain is completely out to lunch obama’s position is not one i agree with.
As Mc would say, woman’s mental health is just an excuse for abortion on demand from the most radical pro-abortion supporters. /s
working Mark Levin link for your 26 above
listened to about 4 minutes – the reason he goes after O’Reilly is Bill-o’s
trying to save his seat by bashing GWB – too damn funny
like so many here, have been waiting for this moment for some time. It is the opening shot of The Exorcist where Father Merrin watches across a wide expanse of Iraqi desert to see two wild dogs fighting to the death under the Idol Pazuzu
and yes, it’s even better than I thought it would be
Maybe this should be ameded considering McCain’s distain for a health exception in last night’s debate.
not sure that obama doesn’t agree
new post up from Spencer Ackerman – The Face Of Hate Has Shown Itself
Actually it was 11 procedures AND there was only 4 physician’s in the WHOLE country who was performing the procedure.
SO the wingnuts want to dictate to Physicians the safest and BEST procedure to treat their patients. So lets go back to blood letting and drilling bur holes…… to let the demons out……
Yes legislate what Insurance companies do or try to prevent BUT let physician’s decide what procedure would be best to treat their patients.
Take this to the extreme…..
they tell you what kind of Hysterectomy you can have
What kind of knee replacement you can have
what kind of appendectomy…….
What kind of treatment for breast cancer….
Once we declared Pregnancy a medical condition then leave Physicians alone.
Agreed, GilpinGuy. Obama did very well last night on the abortion answer. McCain’s disparagement of the popular health exception will not serve him well, nor should it. The health exception is absolutely necessary. Obama is creating a good sized majority that will meet in the middle on this issue, get some good work done on it, and perhaps put it to rest as a wedge issue. Several prominent ‘pro-life’ Catholics (Doug Kmiec, Nicholas Carfudi to name two) have endorsed Obama this year because of his willingness to work with the right on abortion and the Democrat’s record of actually reducing the frequency of abortion while Republican administrations have historically seen abortion frequency rise. That’s because sensible, fact-based policies like comprehensive sex education, easy access to contraception and social support for poor families and single mothers do make a difference.
Last night Obama drew a line and made it clear that he did not agree with Lewis’s comparison between George Wallace and the McCain campaign. But McCain completely avoided acknowledging that his campaign has gone way over the top focusing on the Obama/ Ayers association and McCain did not say anything critical of Palin’s outrageous and inflammatory comment inferring that Obama had been “palling around with a terrorist”.
I think if McCain and Palin keep repeating the inflammatory and outrageous comments that Obama had been “palling around with terrorist” This is going to take them out.
Unfortunately the far right bases their position on their incompetent reading of Jewish law. First of all, they take quotes out of context of the whole, which is a mandatory component of Jewish law. Secondly there are four levels of comprehension. Zero Christians recognize the purpose of the Jewish stance on abortion has specific relevance to having each Jewish child born to a Jewish mother. That is the criteria for identification as a Jew. The matter specifically is Jewish.
Secondly, when anyone reads beyond the most literal words and comprehends the patterns within the whole, they understand the soul of the fetus enters at the beginning of the thrid trimester. It is the point wherein every mother who pays attention knows the massive difference in the fetus becoming a baby in its own right.
I am sick of Torah illiterate right wingers making everyone subjected to their own illiterate and unconscious comprehension of Jewish law and imposing their ignorance and bias on all of us.
God has made the system. Let us all pay attention to the truth. The truth is available to anyone who pays attention to the emerging pattern demonstrated by the fetus in truth and awareness. Any conscious mother recognizes the shifts and the difference between a mass of forming protoplasm and a being with consciousness.
The times when the soul enters at a later period in the pregnancy are in the case of highly evolved beings who could not be trapped inside the body of the mother for such a long period.